SAVE THE DATE: Sleep Summit Oct 8-11, 2024

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The #1 Learning Experience for Mattress Pros Mastering the Art of Sleep and Sales.
ALL NEW

Tempur + Sealy’s Research Shows Rewired Brains

https://radiopublic.com/dos-marcos-GAB04Z/s1!a91cf

Get ready to feel the Burn! TSI’s John Burn unveils new research showing how consumers have changed and how that’ll impact mattress retailers. 

What are the big trends?

  1. The concern for safety and security is shifting to a permanent behavior.
  2. The number two factor leading to shopper conversion is the combination of RSA quality and shopper privacy.  You’ll have to listen to discover the number one factor. 
  3. There are more ‘Sleep Maximizers’ and ‘Discerning Decorators’ shopping for mattresses right now. 

Coming up August 26th, TSI has a virtual get together for retailers where they’ll expand on the research and show you how to capture growth now, while business is hot.

Head to RetailHasChanged.com to register. 

Nationwide Help Center 

Nationwide Marketing Group has launched a BACK TO BUSINESS HUB packed with useful information for independent retailers.

For Dos Marcos listeners seeking expert advice as they navigate the changing environment, we have an email address for you to use: help@nationwidegroup.org.

Thank you to our headline sponsor Nationwide Marketing Group.

As a member of Nationwide Marketing group, you instantly have access to over 200+ ambitious, entrepreneurial-minded advocates who are dedicated to helping your business thrive. Nationwide serves more than 5,500 independent retail members with tools, resources, training, and technology to help their businesses grow.

Podium

Podium is the ultimate messaging platform.

Podium consolidates text and messaging channels into one easy-to-use system.

During COVID, mattress and furniture retailers have experienced a huge influx of questions and inquiries from people wanting to do business in a contact-free manner.

Podium allows businesses to generate a link and request payments via text, no customer log-in required!

You can try Podium Starter for free right now.  Head over to Podium.com/dos today and start capturing more business!

Doorcounts

Join us in welcoming our new sponsor, !

Foot traffic is expensive. Do you know what’s more costly? We call it “Track Lack.”

If you lack the ability to track who’s coming into your store and what happens while they’re there (and after they leave), you could have a severe case of “Track Lack.” 

Doorcounts is a tracker and a connector. Doorcounts Connects: 

1. A smart camera to a CRM database. 

2. Every customer to a salesperson.

3. Better insights to your business decisions. 

4. More sales to grow your business faster.

Here’s how Doorcounts works:  1) a camera sends a photo to the next salesperson’s smartphone. 2) the salesperson then records details in a CRM database and upboard from their phone 3)  actions can be automatically scheduled and/or fulfilled 4) you never miss another sales opportunity. 

We’re really excited to partner with Doorcounts. out Doorcounts.com today and tell them Dos Marcos sent you! 

Watch the live video of most episodes at Facebook.com/MattressPodcast.

Make sure and subscribe to our email for your direct dose of Dos Marcos.

Full Transcription:

Mark Kinsley:

It really was good to see chicken Stanley again yesterday. 

Mark Quinn: 

Yes, it was. 

Mark Kinsley: 

I mean, he started off at Nationwide when we gave the rocky, the fight you’re in, the five-fight chamber at the wind speech. 

Mark Quinn: 

Remember, how katy was? he was just this little baby chick. 

Mark Kinsley: 

And then he disappeared. And now he’s back. And he’s part of the photoshoot. Yeah. You know, nationwide number one, I guess I just saw Miss, like live events and being there with my friends. But what I love is exploring what nationwide does deeper, especially on their website. And I was just thumbing through there to continue to like extract like the value that they give to their members. And I came across this really cool story about Matt Smith, who owns snooze mattress company in Publow, West Colorado. And it was a reminder about some, some of the things that nationwide that we don’t always talk about. Matt through nationwide discovered the reveal system by x sensor and its body mapping technology, they can put people on it, so that they can confidently recommend mattresses with authority. We always talk about fitting people for the right mattress. Well Matt and his team discovered the reveal system through nationwide, brought it in. It paid for itself in two days, they’ve had an 85%, close rate, all of them are high end mattresses and 70% upsells on adjustable basis and custom pillows. How would you like those numbers? 

Mark Quinn: 

I would like them a lot, especially if all I took was for me to go to a nationwide event and discover that, you know, it’s just when you’re walking a floor and you see something like that. That’s the only kind of it’s only those experiences Kinsley, where you can like find the unexpected, right? You like you’re walking down the island and you see something over there. And you’re like, what is that you like, go check it out. And then it turns out, it’s like this little piece of gold that you did not anticipate running into. So that’s what happens at Nationwide events. So, you got to stay engaged. You got to stay connected to them. 

Mark Kinsley: 

Yeah, very cool story. Great job to rob Stein and Amy Croom for putting together these members stories. I love reading them and great job that Matt and his team for taking something implementing it and seeing the results, especially since it paid for itself in two days. That’s pretty clutch. And another thing is really clutch is whenever you can have people pay for something in way less than two days. And that’s what you’re able to do with podium. So, with podium, which is our new sponsor, we’re super excited about that, with podium. We talked about that. We’re going to actually talk about this on this podcast coming up john Byrne. You win in the transitions. And what do we mean by that? If you and I are running a relay, and I try to hand you the baton, and I screw it up, and it drops. What happens we lose the race; you win in those transitions. And one of the transitions that’s ever apparent with podium right now that they’re solving is the transition from, I’m leaving the store. But I’m very interested in the product, maybe anytime I need to think about it, maybe I’m going to shop around. Now your salespeople are able to text message a customer right then and there with all the information about the products they’re interested in with a payment link. Because you’re probably like me, once you walk away, the odds of you going back are pretty low. But that doesn’t mean you’re not interested; you’re just going to kick the can down the road and not make the purchase. You can’t ignore a text message. And if they make it that easy to pay for it, right then and there. It’s just mind blown. And it’s not only that, because podium is the ultimate messaging platform. And people want to communicate right now. 

Mark Quinn: 

They do and it’s not about how you want to communicate. It’s about how your customer wants to communicate. And a lot of people like to text. You know, it drives me crazy. Sometimes people are like texting, texting or emailing, emailing. And then like pick up a phone, you know, sometimes you got a big look, people don’t want to do that. They want to text and so pretty, it makes it super easy to do that. So, I think that’s cool. And yes, if I’m walking out into the parking lot, or I’m at lunch with my wife, we’ve been shopping, we looked at mattresses, and then I get a text message that says Hey, remember that bed you just saw. Just don’t waste your time, like, life’s too short. Click this link and just buy it and we’ll send it to your house. That would be really cool for me, that would be a great experience. So, John’s talk to us Kinsley a lot about that experience. He’s talked about taking the online offline or the offline online, but capturing them in the shopping phase, making the experiences great making sure transitions are there. That’s exactly what they do. So, everybody go check out podium.com forward slash, Kinsley? 

Mark Kinsley: 

Dos, DOS podium.com forward slash dos. Don’t type Marcos just head over there because here’s the deal. The starter system, that podium has right now allows you to use messaging right away. So, you can enter some quick details. You don’t have to put in your business credit card and sign up that way, you can start using it for your business right away if you got to podium.com forward slash dos DOS, 

Mark Quinn: 

How much will that cost you Kinsley? 

Mark Kinsley: 

It doesn’t cost anything. You just don’t have to pay anything. 

Mark Quinn: 

What? It’s free? 

Mark Kinsley: 

F r e e with Dos Marcos listeners. Go check it out..

Mark Quinn:

You know, I had a great day in Northwest Arkansas. So, you know, moving there soon. So, I like going, coming into town and like checking things out. But it was great because I get to spend the day with you, Kinsley and you and I haven’t been in the same room in a long time. 

Mark Kinsley: 

It was strange. I mean, I thought it would be more strange than it was because I hadn’t seen you in a long time in person. But we see each other every week. And so, we’re able to keep up with each other. And it’s like, it’s just like an old friendship should be, if you haven’t seen somebody in six months, you should get in the same room and pick up right where you left off. But we really haven’t let that lapse like the baton keeps getting passed back and forth. But I’ll tell you the weirdest thing that happened yesterday, was when you and I sat on a man’s front porch.

Mark Quinn: 

It’s actually his front porch kind of doubles as a business. 

Mark Kinsley: 

And we were surrounded by all these tchotchkes and a $60,000 bronze statue of Bill Haley.

Mark Quinn: 

You say tchotchkes. I call them antiques. The guy was selling antiques. They weren’t tchotchkes. 

Mark Kinsley: 

And so, we’re sitting there on his porch that clearly was set up for playing music. You and I, I’m playing guitar, you’re playing harmonica. And the guy pulls up to his house. And we, then we ended up playing music with him. 

Mark Quinn: 

Well, what was so funny, we were doing a photo shoot for some stuff that we’re working on. So, Kinsley and I were taking pictures. And so, the photographer says, I got and we’re kind of like, oh, crap, this guy is home. And we’re on his front porch. But it’s a store. I mean, in all fairness, but a really cool space. And so, the photographer guys, I’ll handle this. He goes up to the guy, and the guy is coming in, he’s getting his keys out and he’s going to unlock the door and he says, hey, I’m sorry, but we kind of thought that would be okay. And are you fine with it? He said, Yep, I’ll be right back. I got to get my guitar. So, he came back out with us, and sat there and played music with us. So, it was it was pretty cool. And I’m like Kinsley, hurry up, play a song with this guy. We’re paying these photographers by the hour. 

Mark Kinsley: 

We ended up playing a, I think it was like a Hank Williams song together, singing it and playing it together. This guy’s name was Jerry. And I’m like, I’ll be back. Jerry. Like, I’ll be back for your jam session. So super fun. And we’re kind of having a different time at jam session today. We’re jamming with our friend, John Byrne, VP of retail and emerging channel marketing with TSI. That’s Temper Sealy International. John, thanks for hanging on our front porch here jamming with us. Tell us what’s going on with you these days and with TSI?

John Byrne: 

Thanks for having us guys. Yeah, super exciting time because you know, where we’re, we’re living in this unprecedented marketplace, plus the pandemic. Business is jamming, as you started saying. So, doing our best to navigate this, waters and help our retailers. You know, extract as much business on the growth as they can possibly can. So bc tonsured CSI. 

Mark Kinsley: 

There are a lot of really smart people at CSI. I know them and I know behind the scenes, there are many I haven’t met yet. Tell me. Have you encountered anyone at all the brain trust that’s there under roof? Who said yeah, I could have predicted that. On the heels of COVID, mattress businesses are going to go. 

John Byrne: 

Not single human beings.

Starting, I’ll tell you starting with our CEO, Scott something, you know, he said, you know, I have predicted many things well in my life, but this one, you know, it it just it just didn’t score in my book. 

Mark Quinn: 

And are you telling me that roosting didn’t nail that? John, come on. Roosting is a smart guy, he had to have known. 

John Byrne: 

In a moment of humbleness, they will tell you that he couldn’t have predicted it. You know, we did try to, we did try to stay very nimble. We call it the strategy was called optionality. You know, every week was different from the following week, but we didn’t hide a navigation course we didn’t have a prediction. In fact, if there was a prediction, it was a doomsday scenario of anything. So, so now the answer is no, they just it’s been a pleasant surprise or little, a different type of headache. If you think from a manufacturing and our teams in in the plants are going through right now.

Mark Kinsley:

Well, John, it’s one of those times where there’s been a lot of conjecture, and people are making guesses about what’s going to happen next, what’s happened so far, that’s going to stick. And we saw this in the middle of shutdown, we were talking to people, and there are a lot of opinions floating around. And people are trying to get information, you know, from the brother-in-law, or from a friend or a neighbor, or from some other business owner, but there wasn’t a whole lot of data to really wrap their minds around and get their hands on. And I think we’ve come far enough in the process at this point, where we’re starting to see some of these trends emerge. And we’re starting to think to ourselves and within our businesses, what’s going to stick? What do we need to prepare for, that’s not just a little wave? This is really like, an undercurrent like this is a Riptide like, this is something that they could really take us down if we don’t pay attention to it. What give us some of the highlights because you’ve gathered up research. And that research is going to be presented, will tell you where you can get closer in touch with that research that TSI is doing. Coming up and give us some of those headlines that float around your building, about what these trends are, what’s changed permanently and some of the data that you’ve gathered up.

John Byrne: 

So, our approach was in this moment of uncertainty was alright, let’s, let’s start to figure out what we know before we start trying to decipher what’s going to come down the pipeline. So, we started doing so as I told you in the beginning, Kennedy’s weekly pulses, in fact, we meet every Friday at 10am. We run weekly pulses to really understand a different area of the business that we need to answer questions, you know, so where is the shopper behavior shifting? Where are the sort new sources of information of anything that they’re going to gather, you know, product information? What are the most trusted sources of information nowadays? What’s the role of the RSA? So, we had, we had a learning agenda. Kinsley, that was long and broad, but we broke it down into little pieces, met on a weekly basis, ran multiple polls, which we’re going to continue to be doing and we’ve been doing for the last two months. And then looking at two, three dots, four dot connecting and then say, hold on, we have a trend here. And then what are we going to do about it? 

To your question in terms of right, what do we see now that is happening that is super interesting and challenging for us is the whole approach to the category of macro trends and consumer spending, shifting from what was supposed to be meant for travel and entertainment. And now, being focused on home goods, has been a very well publicized consumer dynamic, but we want to go deeper into it. All right, what within mattress is happening. And there’s a couple of interesting developments based on the research around the primary reasons by which consumers are leaning into mattress is because of discretionary reasons. That is different from what we had had pre COVID, which is basically my mattress broke down. And I don’t have a discretion about it. So, I’m discretionary. So, we used to be the majority of the factors driving it. But now we see more consumers deciding to look for better quality sleep, because either I’m looking for health and wellness reason or want to maximize my sleep. So those discretionary elements now taking the majority of the session factors, that’s interesting. We continue to peel the onion and we see that the average spend is also increased dramatically. So, in the last three months, the average span, the average intense span has gone almost 15%.

If you look at it by bandwidth, consumers, a quarter of them are willing to spend $2,000 or more in mattress. So, you have more consumers bringing into home goods, their spend, willing to spend more. And not only that if you’re looking to buy segments, we have consumers that are what we call a share with you our segmentation, we call it sleep maximizer. Those are the highest value, more engaged shoppers when it comes to sleep. And he’s the single fastest growing segment. So normally more people are coming into mattress and willing to spend more, but they’re seeking more knowledge and better quality in the mattress that they’re going to purchase. So those are all very favorable market conditions. Just to start talking about some of those. 

Mark Quinn: 

So, john, okay. I want to unpack that a little bit. So, the average price you’re saying has gone up in terms of a consumer giving consideration to the bed, right? Are you saying it’s $2,000 now? 

John Byrne: 

Well, the average went up from 1200 to about 1400. 

Mark Quinn: 

Okay, so a couple of 100 bucks, right. Which is material. I mean, that’s okay. So why do you think that is? I mean, the obvious, because I don’t see a lot of people, maybe you do you, you probably have your finger on the pulse of it much better than I do. But I don’t see a lot of retailers changing up the messaging, where it is about health, it is about living your best life, it is about, I don’t see a lot of that. So, if that’s not happening, then how are they arriving at that decision? Is it just COVID? And all the things in the news about health and sleep? And do you think that’s what’s doing it? Like? What do you attribute the growth of that to?

John Byrne: 

That’s a great point. I think what we’re focusing now as so wide of that development is how can we help retailers realize that they’re leaving money on the table, by promoting their under $1,000 products, in such an intense level, when you have a consumer walk into your door willing to spend more, willing to know more and willing to trade off to a higher ASB. So, I think at the beginning was, hey, we’re opening the doors. Let’s sell what sells? You know, we’ll figure it out. But I think now based on these new trends, I think there’s an opportunity for retailers to sharpen their focus, work with their RSA’s and help their shoppers trade up to a higher quality sleep. That is the main reason they’re walking through their doors in the first place. 

Mark Kinsley: 

This is a good point for us to pause on for a variety of reasons. Quinn, you and I and many others in the mattress industry have been beating this drum for years. And we’ve been saying, we have to make sleep the third leg of the health stool, and we have to have mattress products firmly and directly connected to delivering better sleep. It seems obvious, it seems like we’re just politician staying on message. But if people are spending their discretionary income at this point on a mattress, and to John’s point, the data suggests that they’re called sleep maximizers, meaning they are trying to find better sleep, and they’re choosing to put their money toward buying a mattress. This might be an example of success and traction in the direction we’ve been trying to push the industry, push the messaging for quite some time. John, what would what would you say to that? Does that seem to jive? 

John Byrne: 

You nailed it; I would only add one word to what you just said. Kinsley, they’re looking for by the best possible metrics. That’s what defines this segment has we, that’s the requirement. So totally. And I think if we can change the lens by which we look at the back half and help our retailers deliver, through assortment RSA training, education, and even messaging and communication in their advertising.. I think we’re going to have a much,, you’re going to be able to unlock more growth than what they’re currently experiencing. 

Mark Quinn: 

You guys both made me think of something so fill in the blank content. I don’t know how much of your research and I love that you’re basing a lot of research and I love your snapshots weekly. The you know you’re pulling to 300 people. I love that that pulse kind of like pulse research. I think that’s so smart. But you guys, I want you both to answer this. So, two schools of thought from an RSA’s perspective, because back in the day, John Beggs took over Sealy and he did some really smart stuff. I think he’s a little bit before his time. But he discounted the retail salesperson in terms of their influence on the on the shopping and selling process. And you can’t do that because your RSA is a huge part of what happens in our business. So having said that, Kinsley and I’ve been champions of the RSA having built seat geek together that was completely built for them. But think of this RSA’s perspective. How many of them believe that a great bed is something that people buy? Because they have a lot of money. Right. So, it’s it’s a fluence right. Versus people buy a great bed because they really value sleep differently than those who don’t. Right? My, my thinking is, most RSA’s make it about the money that the consumer has, when they come in, the kind of car that they’re driving, instead of understanding or appreciating the fact that it’s really not about that, it really is about what person values sleep different because if they really believe that they’re asking different questions, John, react to that comment would you?

John Byrne:

The it’s all about asking questions. So, you nailed it. It’s when they come in store. How can you find smarter questioning to understand two things where are they within their journey because one of the findings that we have found in these bosses that they’re walking in much, much more educated and prepared on what they want that they used to be pre COVID. But secondly, understand how to help them in a more customized, unique, personalized way. Get them to that better sleep solution, the best sleep solution. One of the things, we’re just talking about drivers of choice. Nowadays, RSA quality is coming as the number two biggest factor for conversion. So, you know, and it’s tricky, because one of the things I always say quality has always played a role. And still, you know, the majority of shoppers wants to have some quality RSA interaction when they go in store. But it’s about finding that delicate balance of you know, being assisted, and then also respecting their privacy that has, has come up more and more in the latest bosses. But back to you, Mark, I think the role of the RSA in this industry, from a well-educated, personalized service in the store floor is empirical. Right.

Mark Kinsley: 

John, you did a great teaser right there. Oh, you want me to go back to your 

John Byrne: 

Yeah, I want you, I want you. Yeah, I want you to react to that also? Yeah.

Mark Kinsley:

Well, I’ve seen it first-hand. I’ve seen people with maybe limited income, make an investment in a very high-end sleep system, because they needed to fix back pain, or they had a job to be done and the mattress could help them do that job. And I know this, this is not anecdotal, like I have very good insights, because I’ve had friends do this. And so then beyond that, you know, we talked to many, RSA as many retail managers. And when invariably, whenever they asked those right questions, and we’ve talked about this for years. Good open-ended questions are your secret superpower. And when they ask those good questions, and they reveal those issues, and they map that to products that actually solve those problems. We see average tickets go up. We see people get a product that’s better fitted for them. So, there’s no question about it. It’s just a matter of, like you said, John, I think this is a this is kind of a great teaser here. You said the number two factor that you’re seeing in the data right now. And shopper conversion is a combination of RSA quality, and shopper privacy. So, we’ll get to number one here in a moment, which I don’t have in front of me, this would be fun. This would be news for me, too. So, we’ll get to number one. But the number two factor being RSA quality and shopper privacy, take us into RSA quality, we get what that is but what do you mean by shopper privacy give us a little more texture on that one. 

John Byrne: 

What customers, what consumers intend or sent to us is, first respect their time by asking the right questions. If you think about it in, in the midst of the COVID, you know, you’re almost risking your freaking life to get on the car and go to the store. So, once I get there, I need to make the most efficient use of my time to get the best output out of this risk. So, if I’m going into the store, please respect my time, make sure that you ask the right questions to know where I am in my journey. Where am I in my research, of the best quality sleep and then build from there. Don’t take me backwards. With very basic foundational men, most salesmen will type of questioning and answers versus a more customized personalized. My team, one of the tools that we’re going to be rolling out in this upcoming virtual event. It’s going to be how can we help the RSA consultative techniques? How can it help them be more of a personalized problem solver? And in fact, it goes down to the brass tactics of what type of questions you need to ask based on the learnings that we’re getting from the surveys. How can you provide industry and product education but especially not from your own voice but provide me with trusted resources. I don’t know whether it’s the reviews or third-party data that allows me to educate myself. Or why this is the best mattress. Keep in mind they don’t mind spending the money for the best mattress, but they’re still uncertain, am I getting the right price? I mean is indeed this is it indeed this the best mattress, so you have to address that level of uncertainty in your selling story.

And then lastly, you know, make, make sure that the whatever you recommend, as I said is personalized to their sleeping habits or sleeping needs. So, it feels like what you’re putting forward is like a glove in a hand, is just fits exactly my knees. 

Mark Kinsley: 

John, take us into that first part again, under this is a really good place to kind of go back and add a little more flavor to. Understanding where the consumer is in their journey. So many times, RSA might be sitting in an empty store for a long period of time they see somebody they want to go talk to them, they’ve got so much to say, potentially. What are some of the questions that an RSA could ask to understand where the consumer is in their journey? How might they open up that conversation to really get some of the detail that would help them understand where they’re at the process.

John Byrne: 

So, the journey breaks down in five different stages, and we have questionings, that helps you probe where they are within that journey. You know, we could, it could be that they’re very early still in the trigger stage. Although that was more in a pre-COVID world. Right now, they go in already in a very active evaluation stage. So, they’re, they’re much more informed, they already probably have their top five brands that they would like to go into a deep dive understand features and benefits. And they may only want just to have the multisensorial experience of trying the product. And if it is so, let’s just make sure you deliver on what their needs are at that particular stage, versus starting the education from point zero. So, our team has unique probing questions for each of the different stages within the journey, in a very simple, fast way that in a few minutes, you can assess where they are, and how can you start adding value from that point forward?

Mark Kinsley: 

Oh, yeah, there’s no doubt in my mind, action of folk music is the official soundtrack of door counts. Because door counts is all about taking action to get out of that funk, the funk of not knowing. Door counts is the smartest way to count retail traffic, and then do something with that traffic and have proof and tie it to sales results. Our friend Luis Lopez actually won the door count system, installed at one of the stores, saw how well it worked. He went out and purchased the system for all of his other stores. And he said as soon as that camera went in, boom, the difference maker. 

Speaker 5: 

I knew that the minute I would install that camera in my store, I was going to be able to see why people were coming in, where were they coming from, I was going to make better decisions on my marketing tools, I was going to make that person accountable to show the importance of to our salesman or every person that comes through the door and how much it cost us to bring that person in. All of that stuff ties in together. And then you know, the CRM to follow up with the customers and after they come in the store has elevated ourselves, incredibly. It’s been a couple months that we’ve had it and I can already see the results. I’ve seen a 60% growth in our sales for the entire year. 

Mark Kinsley: 

Right now, on your phone or computer go to door counts.com, book a demo. Tell them to us Dos Marcos. Right, yeah. We’re talking with John Byrne, Vice President of retail and emerging channel marketing with TSI to pursue the international and John, thanks for sharing all the data and given us some of the play by play that needs to go along with that, you’ve got to understand what are some of these trends that are emerging that are going to stick? And one of the things you talked about was the number two factor in shopper conversion is combined experience of RSA quality and shopper privacy. But we didn’t get to number one. So, what is the number one factor that you’re seeing in shopper conversion? 

John Byrne: 

It was a good teaser. It’s actually ease of shopping is the number one. 

Mark Kinsley: 

Ease of shopping?

John Byrne:

Ease of shopping. It’s all about efficiency in the selection process. It’s all about the speed of the checkout, as well as the convenience of delivery. So, a very, a very easy, seamless, efficient, and to win process. And our team would, you know we’re willing about this one. Ease of shopping has always been part of the top five. It’s interesting just to see, it pop-up as a number one. And I think this correlated the best way we could explain it. Kinsley was correlated to this omni channel world that we currently live-in living in the last 90 days. You know, think about your experience when you go to Amazon it’s fast. It’s, it’s you get the education, you get the product, comparative tables, you understand, helps you the select, they already have all your information as a prime shopper. You have click through on your basket, they already have your address your information. And he said he see, he sees and fast overall. So, imagine that you’ve been having the last 90 days or 1000s of those interactions. Suddenly your expectations heightens, and you expect that level of ease of shopping regardless, that shopping environment that you’re currently walking into. Whether it’s brick and mortar or as omni channel. So that rewires your frame. And that is another, the challenge is that we want to make sure that our retailers understand that the playing fields have changed. The wiring in the consumer minds around what constitute ease of shopping has changed. You can never go back now. So, what do you need to do in order to start deconstructing your own process and understanding where you currently have breakdowns and what needs to be solved, this key at this moment. 

Mark Kinsley: 

There was a podcast we did with a guy named Jesse Cole. And it was the first podcast to start out 2020. And if we want to go back to that, if you remember, at the beginning of 2020, everybody’s like 2020. Everything’s in focus, vision. 2020 is going to be my year. And then in March, everybody was wiping with a coffee filter. Right? things kind of fell apart. But at the beginning of the year, we were excited. We were really excited to kick off the new year. And I remember this podcast we do with Jesse Cole. He wears a yellow tuxedo every day. He owns a baseball team called the Savannah bananas. And they have grandma beauty pageants, they hold up babies in centerfield and play Lion King music. They have a breakdancing first base coach. They have parking lot penguins. And Jesse told us something that really stuck that I think applies here. He said, you win in the transitions, you win in the transitions. And so, he realized that when people came from their house, and went to the baseball game, it was a transition point, how could the Savannah bananas win. So, they created a playlist that people could listen to in their car, that got them excited for the game, and got them pumped up. So, they would be great fans whenever they got there. He knew that when they pulled into the parking lot from the time they pulled in until the time their car was in its slot, it was a transition and they were losing. So, what do they do, they brought in parking lot penguins to make it easier and direct people. These transitions, those are just examples of going to a baseball game. But these transitions exist within every retail environment. And there are probably many more of them. One of the transitions we’ve heard about lately is what if somebody leaves your store but was very interested?

Well, the transition there is I want to give them information around the product that they were interested in buying, and allow them to pay. And we found out that people were using podium to text their customers, the information about the products and a payment link by text message. Very easy to do, very seamless. They don’t even have to come back to the store and all the delivery, all the scheduling can happen from there. But these are the transitions I think we need to think about winning in especially if your data is saying the number one factor in shopper conversion is ease of shopping that is a big rat’s nest unravel when you think how do I how do I evaluate ease of shopping and make it easier?

John Byrne:

You know, the technology is out there. I think it’s the speed by which you as a retailer can need to adopt it, the investment level that is required, but the ROI that comes with it. I’m going to give an example of rewiring. I think this will be funny on how I change myself, how I expect a seamless shopping experience. I just came from Chicago just moved to Lexington um, a year ago, but I used to live in Chicago and we have the Amazon ghost stores. Have you guys ever walked into one of those? 

Mark Kinsley: 

Now? Yeah.

John Byrne:

Alright. You should. If you haven’t, you should because it’s just going to change your life going forward. It’s basically a convenience store nothing more like that. You go in, you pop up in your phone, a QR code that has all your prime information. You scan it on the way in, kind of a gated way and then you grab a basket and everything you pick within the store, it’s all monitored for you. So, whether the shelves are weighted, so immediate you pick an item its already assigned to you. There’s cameras and tracking devices within the ceiling and unnoticeable that know that Kinsley picked up that can of ketchup or beer, and then you go to your basket and then you walk out and immediately Kinsley you have your report on your phone that says you bought all these items and this is your total that was charged. It took me and then it tells you how much time it took. It took me two and a half minutes. You go in, get a yogurt before heading up to work. You do that three, four times on the way to work. And then on another occasion I needed to stop at a drugstore, I think was a CVS just to buy the same freaking yogurt. And then I go there. First, I noticed that I’m not getting the best price, which is disappointed now knowing what Amazon sells it for in the store. But then I have to go into the self-checkout, there were five guys in front of me. And now I’m running late. And suddenly I go and hold on a second, why am I going through this pain. Suddenly, a behavior that I’ve done before, knowing Amazon go and it was very, it was expected from me, suddenly, I’m totally disappointed. Suddenly, they have raised my bar. And I don’t think I’ll ever buy yogurt in a CVS store on my way to work anymore. So, I think just this this systemic change in consumers becoming more only channel in the last 90 days, has rewire their cerebral nervous system. And now it’s all about what is retailers going to do, like you said, to make those transitions points work faster, and more seamless. And, you know, serving them the same spoon you serve them before COVID is just not going to work. And also, it’s not going to work. It’s just going to damage you from a, from a retailer standpoint.

Mark Kinsley:

This rewiring of the brain and enough time for something to actually stick. This is a real thing. Here, I have two quick stories. Number one, a friend of mine has a Tesla. And he went to Vegas, and he rented a car. And he came back out the next morning and the car was running. Because with a Tesla, you get out of the car and walk away and it shuts itself off and locks itself. You don’t have to suffer the injustice of starting a car, pressing a button or anything. He left the rental car on because that’s what he was used to. Say this, this is my story. Early in my marriage, we got a gift. It was a trash can where you wave your hand at it and it automatically opens is the battery power trashcan. So, I had one it broke. And that was a couple years later. So, I bought another one. I’m like this is great. I love this way, the trash can thing. So, one day, I had a tissue blow my nose. And I find myself waving at the toilet.

Mark Quinn:

How many times have you been in a, in a restroom? And you’re waving at the faucet trying to get the water and you realize it’s not that kind of faucet so you feel like a moron. I’m going to take you guys in another place though. You talk about ease of shopping. It’s also ease of selling. And part of it is in a Tempur-Pedic has done such an amazing job. And one of the reasons is that Tempur-Pedic told their story very well. No, it started out long form and in and like helping people understand why memory foam this space age, NASA was good for them. So that really, eventually they had so much of that story being told, that it made it simple. Right, when the consumer came in for the RSA to transact that sale because they were pre sold prior to ever getting the store. John, one of the things that you shared with us is the fact that 66% of respondents now are telling us that they plan to shop online more often. Right? And isn’t that also part of it. So, it’s helping somebody understand the consumer, what the value proposition is to things in the store, and with the product before they ever make it in because they’re not wanting to be in the store as long, right? So, there’s the appointment shopping. And it’s helpful to them if they if they’re able to learn their way in to a category that’s already mysterious, because it’s a mattress sewn up in fabric. And you don’t buy them that often. So, people don’t really know what’s in them. So anyway, I just think why don’t you speak to that a little bit. I mean, the role that information your website, the interface people have with the types of information. How big is that now, in terms of changing the paradigm or changing the experience? We knew it was important before but isn’t it even different now? 

John Byrne: 

In a big, in a big way. So yeah, this is great question. So, another other poll was about sources of information, right? So where are those shopper drove to gather information, this new journey where they’re self-educated around mattresses. And you know, usually get the usual suspects you know, the mattress brand website in our case Tempur-Pedic.com is top of the list. But then S source trusted sources of information is not only the browser’s brand website, but the second one most trusted is the retailer brand website. And it’s interesting because as I joined the mattress category a year and a half ago, as I talked to many CMOS and retailer owners. You know, they only saw their website as a way to build traffic to their stores because their secret sauce happens in store, right? So, I don’t want to, I don’t want my website to transact. I don’t want my website to educate. I want them just to send them to my store, because the RSA’s we’ll take it from there. That’s my secret sauce. And if you look at this dynamic around consumers becoming more everywhere, commerce, trying to find a different word for omni channel, because it’s been burned out. You as a retailer needs to have a very strong omni channel presence. So, by that, I mean, you need to revisit your website and make sure that you’re delivering the best user experience, the best content, and is seamless, whether you’re looking at it online or offline. And there’s no disconnect, you know, your online is not another version of the newspaper free standing insert, where you just blast them with price offers. That’s all school. Now, it’s a place where I go to get information, where I need to deselect and I have five options. I want to make sure that you helped me deselect those options, helped me provide comparative tables where I can play on based on a feature basis similar to what Amazon does. You allow me to deselect and reduce my number of choices. Engage me with video, video is one of the most engaging click through rate tactics that we’re getting across the board. In fact, where we were redoing our Amazon presence, incorporating much stronger CGI development demos on our product, based

on digital videos. So how much of those tasks are within your website right now. And you know what, you don’t need to solve all this for yourself, you know, you can lean in on your vendor partners. Whether it’s SSB or Austin Tempur-Pedic. One of the things that again, we’re going to be rolling out coming now, August 26, there’s going to be EC widgets that you can plug into your website to help them get bigger click through rate, more education for your shoppers. And make your website work much, much harder than what it’s been doing up to now. So sorry, I’m extending to myself here, but you put your finger on the one here. If there’s, if you ask me, okay, John, you read all this research. What are the two three things that I need to do? Right? I would start with your omni channel presence by far. Of course, cleanliness and safety is in the Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, number one. So, if you haven’t checked that box, I don’t think you’re doing business today. But omni channel is definitely one of them. And I can keep on going. But there’s a lot of room for improvement in creating a strong omni channel presence for retailers.

Mark Quinn: 

I saw that you talked about the QR code and something that you would send to us. I think that that’s something that’s going to stick to Kinsley brought that up earlier, don’t you like. So now you’re going into restaurants, and you’re able to scan for the beer menu or whatever it is. And when QR codes first came out, you had to have a download reader and all of that stuff. Now it’s just built into the camera. I think consumers get that now they understand what that goofy look in the square is. And to your point about video, what a cool way to serve up video in the in the moment of shopping, right? So that QR codes, taking them back the screen to show off kind of experience. I think those just the adoption of this could be really good for us in a product category that requires some explanation. 

John Byrne: 

You know, we added them about a year ago into our top of that price cards. Just for the fun of it to be honest, our head of entire experience. So, they will be cool to have the opportunity to grow that. So, if you are alone and you haven’t seen your RSA, you can bring your phone and pick up the QR code and get more information right there. So, you, you make the best use of your time. But what we’ve seen is something that started just, that’s for the fun of it. It has taken great momentum; we see much more usage of the QR code in our PLP in store that we ever seen before. Research when we run one of the polls was about cleanness and safety. There’s a little bit of a hesitation of consumers touching anything, touching a pamphlet or a brochure touching anything in store. So, the more you can do it contact less, the better. So, there you have a very easy plugins solution for your top of that price cards that you can you can activate right away and, in fact, we do it for all our product all our price cards across the entire assortment right now.

Mark Kinsley:

You know, there was a time whenever QR codes, people really didn’t know how to scan them what to do with them now. Especially with Snapchat, I think even just, get somebody else’s snap code, you scan it, it’s a QR code. And what a great opportunity, I think at retail, to be able to guide people to the information you want them to experience first. Especially if you pop it up with video and, and contactless I think that you know, there was a long time when I was working in my agency days where I’m like, nah, like we’re a little bit ahead of our time, let’s not do QR codes yet. All the data suggests that people don’t even use them don’t know how to use them. But that time has passed. And now that we’re thinking contact free, and like you mentioned when grabbing a menu on your phone and not having to have a menu that’s been passed around from patron to patron whenever you go to a restaurant, it’s pretty attractive. 

Mark Quinn: 

Kinsley, do you remember, were you with Leggett at the time we had a spa and QR codes had just come out or I had just discovered them. And so, in my head, I was like, okay, we’re going to act at spa, we’re going to like put QR codes and everything and it’s going to be really cool, because no one knows what they are. And we’re going to give them a little like explanation on how to do it. Number one, download the app that you have to use to shoot the QR code. But then we had cool videos like linked everything. Were you there at that time?

Mark Kinsley:

No, I don’t think I was. 

Mark Quinn: 

Okay. Because if you were, you probably would have talked me out of it. Because the reality is, to your point, nobody had a freaking clue what the QR code was. And so, they saw this thing, and then they’re like, okay, download it. So, you know, you know that what was required to actually bring that to life or see what it was about, you had to download the app, and that the internet connection wasn’t great in the building. So, you’re just kind of ahead of your time. Anyway, I think maybe seven people, you know, many have actually done it. We got through all this work. And we were so excited. It was so cool. Don Ryan, I’ll never forget with Ray global graphics came through and he’s like, what’s that? And I told him, he’s like, oh my God, we’re going to put it on all of our wine bottles and do all this stuff. And anyways, it’s easy to get excited. But now, you can use them and they actually work. So being ahead of your time is not necessarily a good thing. 

Mark Kinsley: 

So, at times you can be so ahead of, you can be so far ahead of your platoon that you get shot in the back. Just you’re a forward thinker Quinn, you’re a doer. And you’re a guy that has his finger on the crystal ball, and he’s looking at what’s out in the future. You’re just heading you’re time

Mark Quinn: 

Woah, I am easily excitable. Am like a little kid like waiting for Christmas. I see. I don’t like oh my god, this is going to be incredible. And it is like several years later. So, 

Mark Kinsley: 

All this to say you were right.

Mark Quinn: 

Thank you, Kinsley. I knew I was right. Right at the, right at the wrong time. And so, John, you talk about this live event you have coming up, and we want to definitely make sure people have access to that. It’s going to be on August the 26th for everyone. You can register for this event at retail has changed.com. If you’re watching this right now on Facebook, or the zoom event, you can see the graphic there. You talk about taking people through several modules. Can you give us a little tease on? We’ve talked about some of those things, but what are we missing? What else are you guys going to be talking about? And who is the event for?

John Byrne: 

The event came as a proactive idea from our weekly meetings, reviewing balls research, we thought, oh my God, we’re connecting new thoughts. There’s significant new behavior here. First, what are we doing to help our retailers? Right. Does our tools still work? Retail edge, which is our platform for helping our customers drive velocity, install velocity and conversion. You know, are they those tools still work? So, we went back and look at the tools and said, right? Yes, they still valid but there’s a whole new set of what we’re calling accelerants that are near to high impact, that we as a team committed to put together to help our retailers unlock maximize growth, whilst the pandemic. So, we thought right, why don’t we find virtual live event which we never done before, where we invite our entire retail base, buyers, marketing teams, merchandisers as well as our own sell force, and then share not only the new shopper dynamics that we’re witnessing here, but also the new tools that are available on hand to sell that they can plug in right away. These are not things that are coming down the pipeline. These are quick accelerants available for you, Mr. retailer, may most of them are no costs provided to you by temper that you need to plug in and why. So, we decided to put this virtual life event together. It’s about an hour and a half. We’re going to start with the reducing our personal sales just framing up, hey, there’s a whole new marketplace out their guys, and what that means in terms of you and your business. And then what we’re going to do is we do have subject matter experts for multiple areas that you as a retailer, whether you’re with your marketing merchandising team, you can find your own track and decide, alright, based on my interests, based on my own tension points right now, I want to go deeper into RSA training. So, Dan personally helped me. How can I help make my artistes deliver ease of shopping sample and then believe the whole model around training. And how can you start making and asking the right questions to find what point of the journey, the shopper that is entering your store is, and that’s one module around training. There’s another module that is all about advertising. So, this is interesting, we took all the data that we have had in terms of what works. So, if you think about keywords, if you think about messaging, what messaging is getting the biggest click through rate today, based on the best knowledge from our own agencies. And the intent is to share all those ways to optimize your own media and advertising and targeting as a retailer, using our own mistakes. What have we learned, what didn’t work? and what worked? so immediately, you could put it to play in your marketing plans, that’s advertising. We have another module around in store? So, in this contact less age, how the future of the store would look like. And it goes on and on, we have a map tool where we have updated a huge amount of database that as a retailer, you can go to the map tool, and understand the demographic composition, whether your store is located. And what is the optimal assortment that you need to carry on the floor, not only for your in store, but what’s the optimal assortment for your, for your online website as well. It is a new module that we just added in this post COVID rollout. So, I can go on and on. In general, there’s about 15 new accelerants that we’re making available for retailers on all seven different fronts of retail edge. And we’re hoping that they make the best use of it. And they will have not only downloadable playbook, kind of a step-by-step approach, but also the help of our own sales associates to help them make it put to work. So, we’re excited, I think it’s going to be of added value. Otherwise, we would not be spending the time and the energy with the retailers that we have been able to 

 share peak preview of the work. They were super ecstatic. And in fact, they just wanted their entire team to take part of the webcast. So, we feel we got something good and we hope that your audience join us in that as well. 

Mark Quinn: 

So real quick question before I, Kinsley is going to jump in. How many people do you think are going to be attending the live event on August 26? Just to hear roosting versus learning something about the rest of that stuff?

John Byrne:

Well, Roosting is quiet, it’s a celebrity name. 

Mark Quinn: 

He’s a draw, he’s a draw, John. All right. I think that at 80, 20 we just don’t know which one is 80 and which one is 20.

John Byrne: 

I mean, he looks sharp, I mean, that hair looks sharp. He is celebrity in industry so he’s, he’s, 

Mark Quinn: 

But let’s be very clear. Kinsley is number one with hair, Steve Roosting may be coming like a close second. Kinsley, you’re going to say something much more important. So, I toss it back to you, my friend. 

Mark Kinsley: 

That’s debatable. Well, that. Thanks, John for number one for sharing the data. And, and just to kind of clean it up a little bit. This is not just a small sample, I mean, you guys really rounded up a robust sample size representative, that that tells us Hey, these aren’t just a collection of opinions, this is not cherry picked. This is going to be real information that can be backed up statistically. So, I think that’s, that’s huge number one. And then, you know, from a signup’s standpoint, retail has changed.com is the URL. So, people head over there get signed up. I’m excited, you know, for people to have to be able to anchor some of their thinking, in in that data that is more meaningful, instead of a lot of the conjecture that’s been out there. So, I applaud you and the team at TSI for putting that together and, and helping people out and I think that’s what we’re kind of thinking about as an industry right now. How do we continue to help each other out? Because there is an opportunity. And I think when people go to the live event that you mentioned, you know, it’s all about what do you need to do right now, to capture as much growth as you can and that’s what you’re going to learn about because like, like you had mentioned when we previously spoke, we don’t know if the spigots going to get shut off at some point. So, let’s get after it now.

John Byrne: 

100% agree.

Mark Kinsley:

Well guys, this was fun jamming with you.

John Byrne: 

It was a good jam. It was a good jam.

Mark Kinsley: 

Good jam session and I did notice that when you whenever you sent me through the Amazon go store. I’ve purchased ketchup and beer which sometimes I would mix, mix together and make a clomado, why not. 

Mark Quinn: 

But wait so what I caught from that. I was going to give John shit for it but I thought I wouldn’t interrupt that. Let him go. I have never personally purchased a can of ketchup. Have you Kinsley?

John Byrne: 

Guys, I was I was going to go with a can of beer but I didn’t know whether my alcohol background is biased.

Mark Quinn: 

Let me ask you a question John. How much beer do you actually drink in a can versus a bottle? Be honest.

John Byrne: 

Well, in the in the in the liar category mainly can, in the premium import only bottle. 

Mark Quinn: 

All right. All right. So, you are you committed to take in a tequila shot with Kinsley and I, which is the official beverage of the Dos Marcos podcast? Can we can we talk you into that? 

John Byrne: 

Bring it on. You will be on the harmonica, he will be on the guitar and I’ll be a server.

Mark Kinsley:

And a guy named Jerry, we’re just going to be hanging out on his front porch. So, I’m pretty sure how this is going to go down. Well, guys, I enjoyed it. John, it’s it’s really nice to have you on the podcast. Thanks for making time. Thanks for hanging out with us. If you’re watching on Facebook or on on video, there’s there’s me jamming with Jerry, on Quinn’s phone. I didn’t know you recorded that. 

Mark Quinn: 

I did, I had to get a little bit of that. I’m telling that story by the way, my kids think I’m a moron. So, in a lot of ways. So, I was telling them that we were on this guy’s porch and he just said, hey, we’re going to play music and my daughters like me like, you are such an idiot. Like, how do you like just, it’s so Gabby says to Bridget, she said, is Mark Kinsley: like Dad? and she’s like, he’s exactly like dad. So, the point is being able to talk people into or find yourself in very random situations, because you just invite that crap into your world. So, 

Mark Kinsley: 

We didn’t even mention, did you tell your kids that first we were playing guitar on a porch for the guy we didn’t know. And then we’re getting chased by a guy in a gorilla mask. While you and I are on a tandem bicycle. And we didn’t know the guy that we asked to wear the gorilla mask that actually happened yesterday.

Mark Quinn: 

But I told her that too. And she said, well, who wore the gorilla mask? And I said, we just saw some guy on the trail and we just talked to him and and asked him to do it. And he agreed to do it. And she’s like, why would you ask some random guy, some stranger you don’t even know. And so anyway, it’s just 

Mark Kinsley: 

His name was Jesse by the way and he was with his buddies. And they were hanging out and we gave them social media gold because they were grabbing content of their friend Jesse running around in the gorilla mask and it just all worked. Whenever. This is, this is all about the brand. This is what your kids need to see. when you fly your flag. 

Mark Quinn: 

That’s right. 

Mark Kinsley: 

And it’s a Jolly Roger pirates are going to come get on your ship.

Mark Quinn: 

What is our flag by the way like moron is that the flag? 

Mark Kinsley: 

It’s the fun flag. It’s the fun flag.

Mark Quinn: 

The fun flag. All right moron fun. That’s good. I like I like fun flag.

Mark Kinsley: 

It’s from James designs flags. I’m going to have him. I’m going to say James design the fun flag for us. 

Mark Quinn: 

The fun flag for Dos Marcus. I like it and we got John on board and we’re going to have two heli shots. John, you’re awesome. The content, the information fantastic. Love what you guys are doing to help your customers. We think that’s a big deal. We’re on board with you. Sleep is a big deal. It’s not a dotted line anymore. From the stuff that we have, into the products that we sell. Our products change people’s lives. The industry needs to embrace it more. Don’t miss John at the live event, August 26 retail has changed.com. Go check it out. What time is it? I mean they can register in advance but what time on the August 26 is at you know?

John Byrne: 

11a.m. Eastern time. 

Mark Quinn: 

All right. 11a.m. Block it out. Kinsley, what’s left?

Mark Kinsley: 

Let’s play that funky music.

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